Friday, August 08, 2008

More Illegal Immigration Insanity

Have we lost our minds? I read this and just about went through the roof!
Ordinance would require shelters for day laborers

Daily News Wire Service
Article Last Updated: 08/05/2008 11:50:59 PM PDT

LOS ANGELES -- Companies that open large home-improvement stores in Los Angeles would have to set aside space for day laborers under an ordinance unanimously approved today by a City Council committee.

The proposed ordinance was passed by the Planning and Land Use Management Committee, but must still be approved by the full council.

If passed, the ordinance would require new home improvement stores that are 100,000 square feet or larger, or any building or structure where 250,000 square feet or more of warehouse floor area is added, to set aside space for day laborers seeking employment from customers.

The shelters would have to be easily accessible and equipped with drinking water, bathrooms, tables with seating and trash facilities.

Home-improvement stores would also be required to develop a security plan in consultation with the Los Angeles Police Department.

Bethany Leal with the Multi-Ethnic Immigrant Worker Organizing Network, which supports the ordinance, called it an example of "immigration integration."

"By having public and private entities work together to create facilities used primarily by immigrants, individual residents, as well as the whole city, benefit," Leal said.

A Home Depot representative urged the committee to add an amendment that would make the city responsible for operating the shelters.

"The Home Depot looks forward to continuing to work with you and other important stakeholders to develop an ordinance that comprehensively provides guidelines to the various entities that must be involved to address this issue," said Francisco Uribe, senior manager of government relations for The Home Depot. "Unfortunately, the current draft ordinance leaves many unanswered questions that should be addressed."

The Community Development Department already operates eight day laborer sites in the city. Grant funding is used to maintain the facilities at an annual cost of $150,000 to $180,000.
Immigration integration? What the fuck? Notice the usual omission of the operative word illegal that should proceed immigration? This is so wrong on so many levels that I don't even know where to begin.

First, for readers unfamiliar with what is going on in Southern CA (and elsewhere across the US), illegal immigrants congregate each morning around gas stations, convenience stores, and fast food outlets soliciting construction and landscape contractors for day labor (payable, of course, in untaxed, cash money "under the table"). Apparently, this behavior has now expanded to home improvement centers like Home Depot.

Now, what gets me is Home Depot's position on this bullshit. If I were in charge of Home Depot I would do one of three things.

Option #1: Close all my stores in LA County.

Option #2: Provide a fenced-in cage and hire a small army of mercenaries - well-paid, well-trained (preferably prior military), and well-armed soldiers of fortune - to check them all for green cards or proof of citizenship. If they could not produce those documents my security forces would be instructed to round these bastards up and throw them in that cage. I would then have my store managers call the Border Patrol to have them removed from my property. Now, of course, the Border Patrol would probably not do that, so I would be willing to force the issue.

Option #3: Simply refuse to comply, hire the same mercenaries, and force the issue with a good old fashioned stand-off when the law came to try to force my compliance. We would have a war, just like in the old days of the union busters when they hired Pinkerton's and battled with the cops.

The government cannot tell a private business what they can or cannot do when it comes to loiterers and vagrants on their property. This is how fucking communist and socialist tyrants operate, and the shit has got to stop - NOW!


Blogger EvaG said...

Hats off to you. I vote fro option 2. In fact - I think ICE should sponsor the Illegal Waiting areas.

What is this country coming to?

Any more room in New Zealand?

1:03 AM GMT+12  
Blogger Oldcatman said...

As you know, I have been aware of the illegal problem for 30 plus years,
nothing ceases to amaze me anymore!

But yet neither Obama or McCain have addressed the issue.

....and in the back ground, Tom Tancredo keeps whispering--"I've been warning you!"

4:13 AM GMT+12  
Blogger Joe Ramen said...

Eva, welcome and thanks for stopping by. Frankly, I just don't know where sanity is anymore. And yes, there is room in NZ. If you are from the US it is easy to get in here with no visa, and if you have any kind of professional skill it is easy to get work due to a skills shortage here. But there are problems here as well. The current Labor government is very socialist/nanny state in its policies. Labor will probably not survive the elections coming up in a few months, however. Stay tuned for updates on what's happening here in NZ.

Lately I have been trying to avoid anything serious, sticking to more frivolous, entertainment-related topics with an adult flavor (ie my "Global Warming" entries and ribald humor).

Thanks for your comments and come back often and tell your friends! I try to have something for nearly everybody who is not easily offended and has a wry, sarcastic sense of humor and enjoys lots of satire.

OCM, we have both been singing the praises of Tancredo for years now, but we see how easily dismissed he was as being too extreme. It kinda sucks when common sense and adhering to the law of the land is now viewed as extreme.

11:00 AM GMT+12  
Blogger BobF said...

It's getting worse Joe. Their have been armed incursions into the United States by Mexican military personnel. Just recently they held Border Patrol agents at gunpoint.

And, what has our President done about it? Not a stinking think except send his good friend Johnny Sutton to prosecute Border Patrol agents if the shoot back.

1:56 PM GMT+12  
Blogger arturo fernandez said...

Greetings from Southern California,

Americans picking up laborers in front of Home Depots and paying untaxed cash is against the law, of course. If for the purpose of painting his house, than the citizen is saving time/money. If for the purpose of charging someone else to paint their house, than the American consumer is getting a lower price for getting is house painted.

I'm not encouraging it. I'm just not that bothered by it.

3:59 PM GMT+12  
Blogger Joe Ramen said...

Arturo, that is all fine and good - as long as those soliciting work are legal to work in the US. I have no problem with consumers getting the best price for their dollar.

However, that is not really the point here. The point is that the council is telling a private business that it has to be responsible for providing shelter and facilities (at the business owners expense) for people who should be getting their green cards checked and then deported if they have no documentation to prove they are legal to work in the US. The fact that the proponents of this bill and countless others refuse to acknowledge that there is such a thing as an illegal immigrant and continue to refer to them as anything but ILLEGAL - that does bother me. Simply being in the country ILLEGALLY makes them criminals; they are breaking the law. If the American people want that law changed (which the overwhelming majority do not), there is a proper way to do that, and that is through Federal legislation in Congress.

It is not right that people who happen to be able to just cross a line in the sand and get all the benefits of being in the US, get to do so, while other immigrants who come from across the globe do not have that convenience and have to wait in line like everybody else. America was built on immigration, but there is the right way and the wrong way to about doing it.

I lived in SoCal (San Diego) for over a decade and saw the problems firsthand.

5:35 PM GMT+12  
Blogger Oldcatman said...

.......and least we forget,
the problem is bigger than
hispanic illegals--20+% of
illegals are not hispanic-
wonder who else is sneaking in bringing terror with them.

Yes, save a $$ here by hiring an illegal but pay it again in taxes to cover
the social services of illegals.

Close the borders!

2:08 AM GMT+12  
Blogger arturo fernandez said...

joe, it was Home Depot's idea initially. They've been doing this on their own in some stores, as a service to their customers, because they know it benefits their customers. Few, very loud, anti-illegal-immigrant fanatics have been giving Home Depot a hard time, so they haven't expanded the program to meet the needs of their customers.

What I see happening is that official worksites will start becoming more appealing to Americans, specially if unemployment numbers keep going up.

So I'm having a hard time seeing why this is so bad.

12:20 PM GMT+12  
Blogger Joe Ramen said...

Arturo, show me where this was Home Depot's idea; it's not in this story, so provide proof of that, please. If it turns out to be true, then shame on Home Depot; they are part of the problem and should face legal penalties for breaking the law. I guess that if it was they're idea, they will just pass on the cost of providing these facilities to their customers. Besides, if unemployment for US citizens is going up, did you ever stop to consider that it may be because jobs are being taken by ILLEGAL immigrants who undercut wages? When people start hiring ILLEGALS to save money/increase profit, that is no longer a free market. That is a market where one group who does not play by the rules has an advantage over another that does play by the rules.

Again, what part of ILLEGAL immigrant do you not seem to want to address? By the very nature of being in the country ILLEGALLY they are breaking the law. You fail to address any of that.

And what is with referring to people being against ILLEGAL immigration as "fanatics?" Is there a law of the land or isn't there? And spare me all the crap about it benefiting Americans; that is weasel-speak. Either change the law through due process of Federal legislation or enforce the laws that exist. Otherwise, what is the point of having any immigration laws at all?

Problems? You fail to address the cost to the tax payer of ILLEGAL immigrants burdening the education, correctional, and health care systems. How many billions of US dollars are illegally sent out of the country each year? The cost of ILLEGAL immigration far exceeds any benefits.

You can spin it any way you want, mate, but the fact is that anybody in any nation without the proper authorization and documentation to prove it is ILLEGAL.

Address ALL the objections I put forth in my first response to you, not just telling me it's not a problem because you wish not to address the issue of LEGALITY.

1:57 PM GMT+12  
Blogger arturo fernandez said...

joe, I was doing some googling and it may be the case I'm wrong about Home Depot's position on day laborers. I had "known" that, I don't remember where I got it. But I can't always be right. Generally I'm opposed to government interfering in private businesses's decisions. I'm opposed to ICE raids on businesses, for example.

Over the past twenty years or so, as illegal immigration has gone up, unemployment has been low, sometimes reaching historic lows. That means that our economy has grown by some 12 million jobs, something not possible without 12 million people, who happen to be illegal immigrants.

That illegal immigrants have filled 12 million less-skilled jobs, while unemployment has not gone up, means that our economy has created better-skilled better-paying jobs for Americans. More Americans doing unskilled work means more unskilled and uneducated Americans. So I believe Americans are better off because of illegal immigrants.

But now the economy is not so good, and unemployment is going up. If there was no fence and enforcement was relaxed, illegal immigrants would be more inclined to leave. But being so difficult to come back, they're staying, needed or not.

There is a good book out, written by Jason Riley of the Wall Street Journal, that takes the free market approach. The book is called "Let Them In." I highly recommend it.

2:22 PM GMT+12  
Blogger arturo fernandez said...

Since you insist I address that their entry is ILLEGAL.

The only useful reason to discuss the illegality of the act is to give us direction in not making the same mistake again. Obviously our immigration laws were not adequate for the demands of a free market economy. What we need to do now is give amnesty to those who have proven of good character, and in the future we must allow more immigrants to come in legally.

2:32 PM GMT+12  
Anonymous Lisa said...

First off, Arturo, I am the daughter of LEGAL immigrants to America. My parents did not come to the U.S. for the purpose of getting taxpayer funded goodies like Medicaid, free health care, free public education, and Section 8 public housing. They waited in line and came here legally. Also, they did not pop out children they could not support, just for the sake of having an anchor baby, like the Mexicans do.

The problem with current crop of illegal aliens is that they don't come here to be Americans. They come for tax free money, and tax payer funded "goodies" which legal citizens pay for.

Another big reason they sneak in, rather getting citizenship is that they want retake the Southwest. All over Mexico, the children are taught that America stole the Southwest from them. They are encouraged to sneak in here, and have as many anchor babies as possible, all for the purpose of outbreeding the rest of us, and eventually retaking "Aztlan" back for themselves.

Former president Ernesto Zedillo said
in a 1997 speech in Chicago to the "National Council of La Raza, a Hispanic advocacy group, that he "proudly affirmed that the Mexican nation extends beyond the territory enclosed by its borders and that Mexican migrants are an important – a very important – part of this."

Zedillo said that because of this fact his government proposed a constitutional amendment that allows Mexican citizens to hold dual citizenship. Spencer believes that the objective is to enable Mexicans in the United States to vote in the interest of Mexico.

So Arturo, I'm sorry, but Americans do not to import a hostile, irredentist population. Those low paying jobs can easily be done by either teenagers looking for work experience, or by our people currently receiving welfare.

3:04 PM GMT+12  
Blogger BobF said...

If having illegals hanging around a home depot store is a good thing for American consumers, than maybe having meth labs manufacture drugs is a good thing too. After all, them meth heads are basically geniuses when it comes to manufacturing illegal drugs. Since there's nothing wrong with using criminals to save some money, why not use the meth-heads and even the mafia. Hey, they provide a service in drugs, booze, women, and everything else.

Yea, I know it sounds stupid, but so does the rational of using illegals to save a few bucks. The problem is, legitimate Americans are going out of business because they can't compete with the illegals since they have to pay their employees benefits and such.

3:13 PM GMT+12  
Blogger arturo fernandez said...

Lisa, I would recommend the book "Let Them In", by free-market capitalist Jason Riley, where he goes over in detail, one by one, the myths you're living by...but some people are way beyond the reach of reason.

3:15 PM GMT+12  
Blogger Joe Ramen said...

Arturo, with your last comments I can say that we are finally reaching some common ground. All I want, really, is for people who come to the US (or any country, for that matter) from ANYWHERE - with good intentions of working, paying taxes, and integrating into our culture to become productive citizens - to do that legally, through proper channels. I am glad you have not given me the radical, militant position (I lived with a woman of Mexican descent for several years, and her brothers were in La Raza, so I got an earful of their nonsense about Aztlan, etc.). I am simply against unfettered immigration.

When I came to New Zealand several years ago and had to find work, I was quite amazed at how strict their immigration laws are here. In order to get a job, one must have employment already lined up. I had to have my prospective employer fill out the necessary paperwork to show the government that they wanted to hire me AND that they had tried to find NZ citizens to fill that position first. Only then was I granted a work permit which only allows me to work for that employer for two years (at which time I have to "re-apply" for another two year permit with my employer stating that they still want to keep me). If I want to change jobs, I have to repeat the process or apply for permanent residency (which I am doing now). Part of the reason for this is (I assume) that because NZ is quite socialist (public health care, extended social welfare benefits, etc.) they cannot afford to overburden tax-funded programs.

Thank you for a reasonable discussion.

3:21 PM GMT+12  
Blogger Joe Ramen said...

Arturo, in response to your response to Lisa, you cannot deny that among a good portion of illegals (and Americans who want open borders), there is that radical element that wants to take back the Southwest. I have seen those protesters and heard their speeches. I have, as already mentioned, had discussions with my ex-girlfriend's brothers who are La Raza members, and they have the same radical views and intentions. I have also visited the La Raza (which I am sure you know means "The Race") website and their motto is "For those in The Race, everything. For those outside The Race, nothing". To dismiss that angle as "myth" is not honest or genuine, regardless of what anybody says in a book.

3:35 PM GMT+12  
Blogger arturo fernandez said...


It's actually the case that more Americans are able to have businesses because they have illegal immigrants they can hire without the government interfering in labor contracts. Like I said before, when illegal immigration was going up, unemployment was low. So it's not true that Americans are losing their jobs because their employers can't compete. Americans are just doing different kinds of work. Americans have improved their skills, they aren't competing with people with fewer skills.


I have things to say about La Raza and us Mexicans wanting the Southwest back. But it'll be tomorrow. It's Friday night here.

3:51 PM GMT+12  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I came here with my parents LEGALLY. My father waited 13 YEARS for his number to come up.

Therefore I see this in black and white. If they are here illegally and, by virtue of that, breaking our laws, they have NO RIGHTS to anything: shelter, food, healthcare, schooling. They should be hunted down and forcibly removed, if necessary. No grandfather clauses either. If they've had kids here their asses get deported, too. As well as any other family member who whines and cries about how awful it would be for them if they leave.

The job they MAY have had will go to someone who is here legally or can be allowed into the country on a work visa. Sure, the cost of that labor will go up but in the long run, the cost to the country is much less given the hundreds of billions we currently spend on these MFCSPOS leeches.

10:49 PM GMT+12  
Blogger Oldcatman said...

Senor Fernandez (the "z" makes it hispanic), lets cut the crap!

I don't know about Joe, Lisa, Bob, etal, I am tired of repeating and repeating the major problems illegal aliens
create in this country TO FOLKS WHO DON'T GET IT! (ie: You, senor!)

Who's going to "pick the grapes"?? I don't give a shit!

I grew up in San Jose (CA)
at the time when the area was #1 in the state for
fruit growing.

From 12 years old thru high school, WE "kids" harvested the fruit--and there are lots of kids in CA today!

Now IF they learn to read and write English, maintain a job (social security, IRS), establish
a residence, no criminal record, etc. etc.--the legal process is in place to become citizens.

Amnesty? Perhaps, IF the above criteria is ALL established!

And never ever forget the 20% of illegals who are not hispanic........

If you commit a crime do the time or take a hike back to mexico!

4:15 AM GMT+12  
Anonymous Lisa said...

"We have an aging white America. They are dying. They are sh----- in their pants with fear! I love it! We have got to eliminate the gringo, and what I mean by that is if the worst comes to the worst, we have got to kill him!"

Jose Angel Gutierrez

– Jose Angel Gutierrez, political science professor at the University of Texas at Arlington, captured on videotape.

"Because our numbers are growing ... [some are] afraid that we're going to take over the governmental institutions and other institutions. They are right, we will take them over, and we are not going to go away – we are here to stay, and we are saying 'ya basta' (enough!)."

– Richard Alatorre, former Los Angeles city councilman at a September 1996 Latino summit conference in Los Angeles opposing California Proposition 209 ending affirmative action, captured on videotape.
"Que viva la causa! It is an honor to be with the new leadership of the Americas, here meeting at UC Riverside. So with 187 on the ballot, what is it going to take for our people to vote – to see us walking into the gas ovens? It is electoral power that is going to make the determination of where we go as a community. And power is not given to you – you have to take it. Remember: 187 is the last gasp of white America in California. Understand that. And people say to me on the Senate floor when I was in the Senate, 'Why do you fight so hard for affirmative action programs?' And I tell my white colleagues, 'because you're going to need them.'"

– Art Torres, former California state senator and chairman of the California Democratic Party, January 1995, captured on videotape.
"California is going to be a Hispanic state and anyone who doesn't like it should leave."

Mario Obledo

– Mario Obledo, co-founder of the Mexican-American Legal Defense and Education Fund, or MALDEF, in a radio interview on KIEV in Los Angeles, June 16, 1998.
"We are practicing La Reconquista in California."

– Jose Angel Pescador Osuna, Mexican consul-general, at Southwestern University School of Law, Feb. 6, 1998.
Sorry Arturo, I don't want these hostile, America hating, irredentist people, or anyone who agrees with them, in my country.

Now illegal immigration will not be stopped by just building a fence or doing immigration raids. Like I've written many times on my own blog, we need to stop birthright citizenship immediately. And the Supreme Court needs to reverse Plyler vs. Doe as well. That was the decision to give the children of illegals free public education.

6:09 AM GMT+12  
Blogger arturo fernandez said...

Anonymous, Lisa doesn't get to use her parents' LEGAL entry as an excuse to corrupt her way of thinking. Neither do you.

joe, seeing the kind of vicious nonsense your website attracts I'm discouraged to spend my time here. But you seemed genuine in one of your comments above, so I'll address your concerns about La Raza/The Race.

Hispanics are not a race, but a mixture of races, and Mexicans (who are mestizos) more so than all other Hispanics. So "raza" in a Hispanic context means something very different than “race” in an American context. When Hispanics speak of La Raza they're simply talking about the community of people, who could be any race including white, who share in their experiences in life: the people of their community. I don't get involved in ethnic politics, so I really don't know much about La Raza. But I'm guessing they're a leftist organization, which would mean that their "raza" is the poor.

Now, let’s keep in mind that these leftists are mostly Americans (of Hispanic heritage only), so the American way of looking at “race” will be present sometimes, so you might hear about “whites” and having to fighting the “white” power structure, whatever.

To leftists’ way of thinking throw in fanatical (expressed several times in your website already) attacks on people of good character, poor hard working illegal immigrants, and the leftists will attack back. Some, very few mostly in college campuses, will come up with nonsense like Reconquista. But they’re few and insignificant. The only thing worthy of discussion is the right wing’s paranoia and how it’s poisoned the debate. You write that “a good portion of illegals…there is that radical element that wants to take back the Southwest.” That’s nonsense. Illegal immigrants don’t know or care what or who MECHA or Aztlan is. Those are radical college professors who think they’re speaking on behalf of illegal immigrants but in fact only encourage animosity towards them.

6:57 AM GMT+12  
Blogger Oldcatman said...

A good friend (another Guy)coined a phrase a while back regarding terrorists and muslims.

He said not all muslims are terrorists BUT all terrorists are muslim.

Interesting--look at it again: NOT ALL ILLEGALS ARE CRIMINAL SCUM BAGS BUT

8:02 AM GMT+12  
Blogger Joe Ramen said...

Arturo, I know fully well about race, etc. - biologically speaking there are only 3: Caucasoid, Mongoloid, and Negroid. All other classifications are ethnicities. However, that is not the point. The point is that is what this group calls itself, and their message is very clear. The fact that you choose not to get into ethnic politics or don't know much about La Raza changes nothing. It's out there whether you like to acknowledge it or not, and it is the left that drives it. Ignoring that will not make it go away and only serves to skew your viewpoint, making you less informed on the overall debate. The emperor has no clothes; looking the other way does not get him dressed.

And your statement about "fanatical attacks on people of good character, poor hard working illegal immigrants, and the leftists will attack back," is backward, and the mis-characterization of who is the fanatic is also reversed in my opinion. The "fanatical attacks" (as you see it) are a reaction to what I see as fanatical attacks that began with the leftists; a reaction by ordinary Americans who see that their way of life is under attack by those whose intentions are not good for America. So our respective points of view on that is a matter of the glass being half empty or half full; the chicken or the egg as to which came first.

As a person who studied Marxism, post medernism, and deconstruction philosophy at university over 20 years ago and was at one time a leftist myself, I can tell you that it is almost always the leftist who attacks first in his effort to change the existing power structure. I have history on my side to prove that.

As for these leftists being "few and insignificant," confined mostly to college campuses, that is nonsense. My ex's brothers, active members of La Raza, are both lawyers. Furthermore, it is not sheer numbers that matter. It is the influence that those few have over the masses. Again, that is classic Marxist behavior. You are correct when you state that most of the illegals are not aware of nor care about the radical element - that is until they hear the radical message from the educated ones who appoint themselves as spokesmen for an entire group. From that point on a significant number of the masses tend to follow that message because it is appealing to their plight and they respect those who promulgate that message because they are the educated ones. It also engenders sympathy from those outside the cause through guilt, thus snowballing further support. They are what Lenin described as "useful idiots." That is the same dynamic that causes riots, and it is the same dynamic that drives the islamic movement.

Regarding "right wing paranoia" - that is a tired phrase with no meaning. Paranoia means having concern or fear where there is no reason to have either (and who determines whether or not one is paranoid is a matter of opinion). There is at least reason for concern, and by putting the "right-wing" label on that only serves to make the statement an argument ender. It is also not the only thing "worthy of debate" nor has it "poisoned" that debate. It is part of the debate, whether or not, again, you choose to acknowledge it or regardless of whether or not it is, in fact, paranoia. I have heard the entire speech that Lisa quoted from former CA senator Art Torres, and I have heard dozens more from those like him. They are out there, and they have more influence than you may care to realize.

So where does that leave us? What we do know as FACT is that we have almost unfettered border crossings along the Southwest corridor, and it has been going on for several administrations now. The vast majority of Americans is against it, yet the government fails to address the issue except for weasel words and some meaningless feel-good legislation. Tension is growing on both sides of the issue. Good, hard-working (yet still illegal) immigrants (until the laws are changed) who want nothing but a better way of life will be caught in the middle. They are going to be the ones who suffer, along with many low-skilled Americans who still need those jobs taken by the illegal immigrants.

11:15 AM GMT+12  
Anonymous Lisa said...

Joe, you used to be a leftist? What made you shift to the right?

11:29 AM GMT+12  
Blogger Mae said...

I am a simple person with what I deem to be realistic responses to comments made. (btw I don't give a rats backside with those who may disagree)

I have found that postings that lead to debating ideologies on any level always turn into too many fancy words and descriptions that end up only serving as visual distractions. As no-one really listens/reads the context of the written words, they only cling to a small portion of a sentence/paragraph and run with it willy nilly to suit their own personal agenda.

I view this whole issue as a non issue. If the people are illegal, whether well intentioned illegals or not does not change the fact they are illegal, and as such you are either for legislated law or not. There can be no valid reasons that feelings, emotions, financial benefit can be brought into play to justify people breaking the laws of the US.

Home Depot/local bodies,or whoever it may be, providing shelter for prospective employees to service customers is just a way of saying, yep we will provide the area to allow illegals to obtain work.

12:34 PM GMT+12  
Blogger Mae said...

Lisa.. yes, Joe was once a raving left lunatic. I give him grief at any opportune moment he presents to me.

Lol.. he wants me to qualify my comment. I won't, as far as I am concerned, black is black and white is white, no matter the time-frame or uni education excuse.

Joe's reaponse: "That's not fair"

Mine: "Joe, fare is what you pay to hop on a bus"

As you see I enjoy sticking the knife in now and again.

12:47 PM GMT+12  
Blogger arturo fernandez said...

Where are all those advocates for Reconquista? Here in this conversation, no one's come forth. I never see them in these conversations in the many blogs I debate. They're always talked about, but they never seem to come forth. Do a google search of Reconquista and you'll get pages and pages of right-wing paranoia, but nothing from those actually wanting it. With many millions of Hispanics in the US, you should be able to link to many blogs out to spread the idea. They don't exist. A few isolated quotes, some probably taken out of context, repeated over and over, the same quotes by the way, does not justify the exaggerated right wing reaction to it. It is a perfect case of paranoia.

The right wing has used irrational fears to attack the character of hard-working illegal immigrants. Anti-illegal-immigrant fanatics say illegal immigrants steal jobs from Americans. As I've pointed out twice before, while illegal immigrants were coming the US had low unemployment, low enough to be considered "full employment" in a free market economy. That they take Americans' jobs is a lie, and "steal" is a vicious attack. The noun "illegals" has been invented from the adjective as a way to insult them as completely as possible.

It is no surprise, therefore, that when the right wing attacks, the left attacks back. We seem to share a dislike of the left. But no surprise, you are completely oblivious to the poison that comes from the right.

5:19 PM GMT+12  
Blogger Joe Ramen said...

OK, Arturo, you are drifting now. You are just saying what you want, but you haven't contradicted what I have pointed out because you don't want to....or you can't. I already addressed that the left attacks FIRST; you don't want to believe that, so who's oblivious to what?

As for the term "illegals" it is used for one reason: Because they ARE! Why don't you at least acknowledge that? It matters not one bit how hard-working a person is if they have BROKEN THE LAW to get into the country in the first place! Get that through your head, man! Until the Federal Immigration laws are changed they are CRIMINALS as soon as they set foot in the country without the proper documentation.

I started off rebutting you with that very premise, and I indulged all your humanitarian reasoning for why things should be different, but now it's just tiring. So, we are just going around in circles here and getting nowhere. I got your point already.

Have a nice life.

12:13 AM GMT+12  

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